Any suggestions with Pinnacle

[squirrel64]

Pinnacle has been reporting since May 2010. This debt is SOL but still within reporting time. (another year left). I was contacted by Laurence Hecker collecting for Pinnacle last year.. Dv'd Hecker twice and Hecker sent a letter dropping his case. Well, 1 month ago I was contacted by Vision Financial collecting for Pinnacle. I Dv'd BOTH Vision and Pinnacle and have not heard anything back from either one. Wondering what to do next. I have read and read and done what I think is right so far, but now I'm not sure.

Should I start with CRA's now ?? Should I send FOAD to CA's ?? I'm sure from all the reading I've done the CRA's are likely to just validate. Hate to waste my time but still want a good paper trail. Still have about 5 days left before DV run its course yet I doubt I will receive anything. Any suggestions from the wise ?

Edit : Pinnacle has been re-aging this account and it shows disputed on EX and TU

[Lian]

It looks like Pinnacle dodged the DV by assigning or selling the debt to another debt collector, starting the process anew. Has Vision sent you dunning notice, advising you of their collection activities?

Who owns the debt? Apparently, it is Pinnacle, if they were able to assign Vision as their agent. Are you sure that they did not sell the debt to Vision?

As for involving the CRAs in the process, I dont see any grounds for contacting them. The DV process is a debt collection process under the FDCPA, and the CRAs have no active part in that process. What would be the grounds for CRA involvement?

[squirrel64]

Vision is working for Pinnacle. I did receive a dunning from Vision. Pinnacle owns the debt and keeps transferring from one agent to the next to collect for them. In the past I just DV'd the the agents (Hecker, Bryant Hodge and assoc., and now Vision) but this time I DV'd Pinnacle along with Vision. No word as of yet. 28 days in now.

I was asking about the CRA's because Pinnacle is reporting this on CR as disputed on EX and TU but not EQ.

They are reaging this debt


I have been advised elsewhere to send Jack Attack but wanted to get another opinion. Should I send a 2nd DV to Pinnacle and Vision ? Sorry just not sure what step to take now. What should be done about a company that is reporting on your CR but never directly sends a dunning themselves. As stated earlier this debt is SOL

[Lian]

Texas has the only state version of the Federal FDCPA that compels any period for response to a DV letter. Unless you live in Texas, all you can assert under the FDCPA is that they must cease collection of the debt until such time as they choose to provide validation. There is no period for response set in the FDCPA.

And even if you DV, if it is not sent within 30 days of their dunning notice, it does not invoke the cease collection provision of FDCPA 809(b).

The DV process is a debt collection practices statute under the FDCPA, and is not intended to be a mechanism for disputing accuracy of credit reporting on its merits.

[squirrel64]

thanks for taking the time to reply Lian.

[Hal Jordan]

I would try sending a DV/SOL follow up letter to them. Then wait a few days after they receive the letter and dispute will all three CA's.

This is not the 1-2 punch. What we're hoping for by doing this is that once they get the SOL letter from you they know that you know they are beyond the SOL so they really won't be able to threaten or scare you into paying. Then by disputing with the CRA's we're hoping they won't bother verifying it since it's out of SOL and they are aware that you know they can't sue you or win a judgement against you.

That's the hope and IMO it's worth a shot. It has worked for me.

If it doesn't work you're basically left with two options. First you can offer a PFD and see if they'll take it. Second you can send them a C&D letter and wait out the next year. They won't be able to resume collections against you after that. In fact all they can really do is send you a letter saying "we're gonna sue you" which we know they won't because they're beyond the SOL and it's also an FDCPA violation to make a threat they can't or have no intention of taking against you. If they do decide to sue you (which would be dumb dumb dumb on their part especially since you've made them aware you know the debt is SOL) all you have to do is show up to court and ask the judge to dismiss based on the SOL. Using SOL as your defense.

Anyway, I guess there's three total options availabe to you. Personaly I would try the letter and dispute first and see what happens. If that fails and you really really want it gone try the PFD. Or of course you can just wait it out for the next year.

Don't give up without a fight and without exhausting every option available to you.. Trying and failing has the exact same results as doing nothing and failing. Atleast if you try you will always have a puncher's chance of succeeding.

[squirrel64]

Thanks Hal, That helps tremendously.

[squirrel64]

Would this be adequate ?


Dear Pinnacle Credit Services,
On DATE HERE, 2011 I was contacted by Vision Financial Corp. (see attached letter) about a debt you say I owe. I sent a debt Validation letter to both Vision Financial Corp. and two different departments of Pinnacle Credit Services. (copies enclosed). I have not received any response. You are still reporting this alleged debt with all 3 Consumer credit reporting agencies without any proof or validation of this debt you say I owe.

I am writing this SECOND and final request for validation for this alleged debt and to let you be aware if there is no response I will be contacting the office of Ken Cuccinelli Va. State Attorney General if you continue to report this account fraudulently. I am keeping a detailed record of all state and federal violations incurred by Vision Financial Corp and Pinnacle Credit Services. You may also want to check with your attorneys to make sure you are not trying to collect on a time barred debt.

Either validate or have this account removed from all three consumer credit reports and deleted from your records.

Your full cooperation is requested


Then dispute all inaccuracies with CRA's

[Lian]

I would not recommend sending that letter.

The FDCPA sets no time period for response to a DV letter (unless you live in Texas, which is apparently not the case).

A timely DV letter is your way of forcing the debt collector to cease collection activities until such time as they may choose to provide validation. The debt collector can choose to just cease collection activities, and not respond.

Violations of failure to validate occur when a debt collector continues some form of debt collection activities after you timely DV them. The violation is their subsequent collection activity, and not their failure to validate.

Accusing them of fraudulent reporting is without any legal basis of which I am aware.
Additionally, there is also no statue of limitations on their continued collection activities. They can continue to attempt collection after expiration of the SOL for legally forcing you to pay by court judgment.

[squirrel64]

Then why do people send SOL letters, or FOAD letters for that matter? Are you saying to just tone down the letter and quietly let them rack up violations? I guess I'm just not sure at what point to start getting more assertive. I have rewritten this 2nd DV 3 times now and still just as unsure of what to do now as I was before I wrote the first one.

I do understand what you are saying Lian. But I came to this board because I was getting so much conflicting information or suggestions elsewhere. And I appreciate your reply before I took the wrong step. But it does conflict with what Hal suggested to a point. You've told me what I should not do, can you suggest what I should do. I do appreciate all the time you and Hal take to help people here.